Registered: Sep 2001
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From here.

Lesbians: We made our baby deaf on purpose

by James Langton in New York
A deaf lesbian couple have admitted deliberately creating what are believed to be the world's first designer handicapped babies.

The two women tracked down a deaf sperm donor to ensure that their daughter, who is now five, would inherit the same inherited hearing disabilty that they both share.

The couple were so pleased with the result that they have just had a second child, called Gauvin, using the same technique. Doctors who examined the boy say he is completely deaf in one ear and has only partial hearing in the other.

In an interview with the Washington Post, the women - Sharon Duchesneau, who gave birth, and Candace McCullough, her lesbian lover - say that they believe deafness is "an identity not a medical affliction that needs to be fixed".

They were so desperate to have children who share their handicap that the women asked their local sperm bank to provide a deaf donor, but were told congential hearing loss immediately disqualifies candidates.

Instead they turned to a deaf male friend for help, producing what they call their first "perfect baby" - their five-year-old daughter Jehanne. Before their son was born, the women said: "A hearing baby would be a blessing; a deaf baby would be a special blessing.''

Both women, who are in their mid thirties, belong to a radical school of thought that believes deafness is a "cultural identity" not a handicap.

They want their children to share the same "experiences" including learning, sign language and going to special schools for the deaf.

They also consulted a "genetic counsellor" before getting pregnant who told them that with Miss Duchesneau's background, that includes four generations of deafness on her mother's side, any child conceived with a deaf sperm donor would have a 50 per cent chance of having the same handicap.

After their daughter's first hearing test, the couple wrote happily in her baby book: "Oct 11, 1996 - no response at 95 decibels - DEAF!'' Their daughter attends a special kindergarten for children with hearing problems.

After tests on their baby son showed he also had severe problems, they decided against giving him a deaf aid in the one ear that still has some hearing, saying they will leave the decision to him when he is older.

The couple's behaviour has appalled children's rights groups in the United States. The conservative Family Research Council said their decision to "intentionally give a child a disability" was "incredibly selfish".

The council's spokesman, Fred Connor, said: "These women are taking the idea of creating so-called designer babies to a horrible new level.''

Even a leading member of the American National Association for the Deaf, Nancy Rarus, said she "can't understand why anyone would want to bring a disabled child into the world".

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hahahhaahahhaha

Bork bork bork!

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The pinnacle of Failbot technology.

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quote:

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Originally posted by skalie
The council's spokesman, Fred Connor, said: "These women are taking the idea of creating so-called designer babies to a horrible new level.''

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Registered: Aug 2001
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This was in my newspaper this morning.

There are some strange people around, for sure.

Why should it matter if your kids fit into your community? They deserve the most opportunity that you can give them, to choose what they want to be.

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quote:

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Originally posted by Daniel
Being Deaf really IS a unique culture

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true. But that doesn't negate what i said.

Deafness IS a culture to deaf people, and Deaf Pride is something that is as strongly appreciated and pursued as Black Power and Gay Pride.

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The kids are better off being deaf. They won't have to go through life hearing people talk about how fucking stupid their parents are.

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quote:

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Originally posted by Daniel
true. But that doesn't negate what i said.

Deafness IS a culture to deaf people, and Deaf Pride is something that is as strongly appreciated and pursued as Black Power and Gay Pride.

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Actually being Deaf (note the capital D... it denotes deaf culture) is a fight against bigotry too. What David Lee Roth said is 100% true. Deaf people are quite discriminated against also.

Think of it... how many times have you said to a slow or stupid person... "What, are you deaf?". And the phrase "deaf and dumb" (which refers to not being able to talk- very common). The implication is that to be deaf is to be stupid. Deaf Pride (or, as taken by some more militant times, Deaf Power) is as serious a struggle as any other war against an oppressive majority.

You might not be able to understand this, as you have probably never been exposed to the deaf world, or even really thought about it, but it's quite true.

However- technological medical advances are starting to take the Deaf culture away from deaf people. Parents are seeing their kids leaving them behind, and they feel hurt, left out, and unwanted. I totally see why this couple specifically wanted a deaf kid. You and i can argue different sides of the debate now, but in 50 years it will be a moot point- there will be no more Deaf Pride because there will be many fewer deaf people- to the chagrin and hate of many older more conservative deaf people who see their numbers declining.

My point is: to be Deaf is to be a member of a very very small world. Almost as literally as a metaphor can be taken. They want their kid to be like them, and not treat them as handicapped, just like any parent would.

Last edited by Daniel on 04-08-2002 at 10:18 PM

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quote:

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Originally posted by Daniel
Think of it... how many times have you said to a slow or stupid person... "What, are you deaf?". .

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id guess this doesnt help gays with the gay adoption/parenting issue

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Well it shouldn't hurt them either- except it will.

If one of the women was straight and married the congenitally deaf guy, and they had a congenitally deaf kid, everything would be fine- the congenitally deaf guy has a right to reproduce. But it's a big deal because as lesbians they searched him out just as a donor? I hate that. I hate hypocritics more than anything else in this word.

*sigh*.

[/soapbox] sorry bout that

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Registered: Aug 2000
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hmm this was on ken hamblin talk radio a few weeks ago

okay, if you make your child deaf after birth then thats considered child abuse?

but i guess purposely /genetically engineering( in a way) isnt child abuse?

i just cant wait till the child grows up and finds out that his/her parents did everything in there power to make them born with a handicap

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this is an excerpt from the Globe and Mail, I thought it was interesting...

"Deaf militancy has the same roots as the disabled movement. Both groups have struggled to change the definition of themselves from defective to merely different. And like all identity groups, they've gone further. They're special, they're empowered, and they're proud.

But as disabled groups aggressively push for integration, the Deaf Culture movement has gone the other way. They don't want to join the mainstream. They think that inflicting hearing aids and cochlear implants and tortuous speech therapy on deaf kids is unethical and cruel. Why set them up for failure when they discover that, no matter how hard they try, their speech and hearing will never be normal? Why turn a happy deaf person into a broken hearing person?

Deaf activists speak about the brutality of assimilation in the same way native people do. Cochlear implants are not just ineffective; they're a threat to a deaf child's "birthright of silence." They argue that deaf subculture offers a rich world of art, history and language (American Sign Language) in which the deaf are vastly better off. "It is time to end the hearingization of Deaf people," wrote one advocate. "We are not a pathology waiting to be cured. We see ourselves as a linguistic and a cultural minority."

In other words, wanting your child to blend in with the dominant culture is a form of self-hatred. It's as if aboriginals wanted their children to be white.

"Many deaf people would rather have a hearing baby -- but such individuals are not confident of their identity as deaf people," wrote the mother in The Guardian. "They see hearing people as better. They have been made to feel that the hearing world is superior, which it isn't."

Well, my mother's parents had another view: that it is. Both of them were deaf, too. They were not self-hating. Both had learned to speak before they lost their hearing, and they never did learn ASL. They got by (sort of) on lip-reading and wretched hearing aids.

It's true that my mother was a very lonely little girl. She couldn't really talk to her own mom and dad. But she never doubted that they loved her. And I am certain that my grandparents never for a second wished that she were deaf like them. The prospect would have horrified them.

It's all very well to want a child in your own image. But someday Gauvin will grow up. He might have an okay life. But he'll never get to be a singer or musician, a reporter, a sound man, a broadcaster or a lot of other things. He'll never hear a bird, or Bach, or waves. Will he be empowered by his deafness? I'm just an auralist, but I think not."

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"hearingization"????

those people are confused.

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quote:

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Originally posted by Inky

Deaf activists speak about the brutality of assimilation in the same way native people do. Cochlear implants are not just ineffective; they're a threat to a deaf child's "birthright of silence." They argue that deaf subculture offers a rich world of art, history and language (American Sign Language) in which the deaf are vastly better off. "It is time to end the hearingization of Deaf people," wrote one advocate. "We are not a pathology waiting to be cured. We see ourselves as a linguistic and a cultural minority."

In other words, wanting your child to blend in with the dominant culture is a form of self-hatred. It's as if aboriginals wanted their children to be white.

"Many deaf people would rather have a hearing baby -- but such individuals are not confident of their identity as deaf people," wrote the mother in The Guardian. "They see hearing people as better. They have been made to feel that the hearing world is superior, which it isn't."

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I don't think that making your child so that they fit into your social group/movement is anything other than selfish; although I can see why a couple would want to do it, I don't see that it is right.

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Hrm. I can't even think of how to justify this even as a Devil's Advocate.

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quote:

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Originally posted by Paint CHiPs
Hrm. I can't even think of how to justify this even as a Devil's Advocate.

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c'mon, give it a shot.

i'll be back.

laundry beckons.

i think i am going to have bigfoot's love child so our kid doesn't need to wear clothes.

i am sick of the laundromat.

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quote:

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Originally posted by Inky
i am sick of the laundromat.

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quote:

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Originally posted by Smug Git


You get to meet a whole new subclass of human at the landromat.

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[feelings]
Well, being an outsider, I have to say that this seems a bit odd to me, if not upsetting. Sure, it's a fight for deaf rights, but it's at your child's expense. It's not as though their lives will be any better or easier by not being able to hear. Jobs will be harder to come by, schooling will be different... but I guess that's what this lesbian couple is banking on. They seem adament on giving Gavin the oppertunity to decide if he wants a hearing device in the future. Why not let him decide if he wants to go deaf instead?

A co-worker of mine has a son with cancer. To me, this is almost the same idea. It's like, because you're suffering, you want your children to as well... then sum it up as standing for one's rights. Not to mention, by saying deaf people are elite, isn't that instilling a prejudism at a very early age? [/feelings]

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This may be a terribly old-fashioned viewpoint, but in my day a perant did everything in his or her power to enable his or her sibling to have all the freedom and possibilities the world could offer.

A real life form of evolution.

If I caught two bulldykes sign languaging high fives with each other because they produced a child that won't ever have a chance to appreciate Mozart there would probably be a punchup.

I'd probably lose.

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