Registered: Aug 2001
Location: Hilbert Space
Posts: 35917

If this works again then the American people really are getting the government they deserve.

Abortion: So important, it's a states' issue.
Gay Marriage: So important, it's a federal issue.

quote:

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Bush circles the wagons as approval ratings slip
By Joseph Curl
THE WASHINGTON TIMES
Published June 3, 2006

With just five months to go before the midterm elections, President Bush, whose once-faithful base has abandoned him in droves, is turning to the same conservative hot-button issues that won him re-election in 2004 -- homosexual "marriage" and judicial nominees.
The president, now fully aware that his plummeting approval ratings could cost the Republicans control of one or both congressional chambers in November, will use his radio address today and a speech Monday to push a constitutional amendment banning same-sex "marriage," just as the Senate prepares to vote on the issue.
The crux of his argument is simple: A majority of Americans support the idea that marriage is exclusively between a man and a woman, and activist judges across the country are thwarting the will of the people. While 45 states have either a state constitutional amendment or a statute defining marriage as heterosexual, judges in Washington state, California, Maryland, New York and Nebraska have overturned those laws.
Thus, there is a White House strategy to move swiftly to nominate more conservative judicial nominees, which political guru and top Bush political strategist Karl Rove sees as a decisive issue in elections -- an issue Mr. Bush effectively exploited in 2002 and 2004.
The president traveled the country in 2002 and 2004 delivering impassioned speeches for Republican candidates, and he regularly won standing ovations when he asserted that a conservative president has the constitutional right to appoint conservative judges.
"The power to nominate judges is one of the most serious responsibilities the Constitution gives the president," Mr. Bush said Thursday in a Rose Garden swearing-in of new Appeals Court Judge Brett M. Kavanaugh, who won Senate confirmation after a contentious three-year battle. "Our founders thought carefully about the role they wanted judges to play in the American Republic. They decided on a court system that would be free of political and public pressure with judges who are prudent in exercising judicial power and firm in defending judicial independence."
An expected wave of judicial nominations -- rumored to be as many as 20 in the next month or so, although this is denied by the White House -- is "not a question of if, but when," one former senior administration official said.
"Democrats will make a huge mistake if they're too partisan and refuse to give us a hearing on the nominees. So it's not even the vote that matters, it's what Democrats do when the nominations come in," the former official said.
If Democrats move to squelch the nominations, the president plans to hammer home the split on core values between the two parties in an attempt to woo back his base.
"We need to remind Republicans to hang together because the alternative is much, much worse," the former official said. "Pushing these two issues is going to shore up the base, because it will remind them of our core values, what is important to us."
But pollster John Zogby, who has catalogued Mr. Bush's loss of conservatives and his swiftly falling poll numbers -- the latest put him at just 31 percent approval -- said the administration's decision to revive a strategy that worked in '02 and '04 may not work this Election Day.
"It's a much different circumstance this time, for both the president and Republicans. They are clearly on the defensive, and unlike the other two years, they've lost a pretty substantial chunk of their base," Mr. Zogby said, noting that when Mr. Bush won in 2004, he was backed by 91 percent of Republicans, but now has approval from just 68 percent.
Some election analysts say Mr. Bush won re-election in 2004 because of referendums on homosexual unions that were on the ballots that year. Thirteen states approved initiatives prohibiting same-sex "marriage," with 11 states casting votes on Election Day.
That year, moral values topped the list of issues voters were most concerned about when they went to the polls, with Catholics, evangelicals, blacks and Hispanics making up an ad-hoc bloc that re-elected Mr. Bush by 3.5 million votes.
This November, there are initiatives banning same-sex "marriage" on the ballot in Idaho, South Carolina, South Dakota, Tennessee, Virginia, Alabama and Wisconsin.
Gary Bauer, head of American Values, said that Mr. Bush has alienated conservatives with his "guest-worker" program on immigration, as well as allowing excessive spending on Capitol Hill, but could pull back his base with a same-sex "marriage" ban.
"The issue does appeal to his base, but it's also a 70 percent issue with the American people," he said. "He's had a lot of battles in recent months that were sort of 35 percent issues, and here's one that it's the left that is associated with something that most Americans are skeptical about."

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Registered: Oct 2001
Location:
Posts: 18758

Thank the Lord we've got someone protecting us from the godless homosekshuals.

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Registered: Jan 2003
Location: mediocre apartment
Posts: 2657

And a country full of single issue voters.

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Registered: Apr 2005
Location: wookin pa nub
Posts: 10883

Republicans = Democrats because they want to tell people what they can and can't do with their personal lives. Do they think they are protecting some "common good" or something? Common to whom? Whose definition of "good"?

[whispers] Vote Libertarian. [/whispers]

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Registered: Oct 2001
Location:
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[nuts like kuglo]no[/nuts like kuglo]

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Registered: Apr 2005
Location: wookin pa nub
Posts: 10883

pinko

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Registered: Nov 2004
Location: Detroit
Posts: 691

You're all SICK!

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Registered: Nov 2004
Location: Detroit
Posts: 691

and that's why i love american steers

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Registered: Sep 2003
Location: Rancho CucAmonga, CA
Posts: 424

I'll bite...

Fubar, in what way have the democrats told you what to do with your personal life? I might be over generalizing, but it seems like the Republicans (in general) want to limit social freedoms, such as flag burning, war on drugs, gay marriage, etc. Unless you're talking about paying taxes?

Jazz

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Registered: Jul 2000
Location: Beatrice, Nebraska
Posts: 19039

I really don't see gay marriage as being Constitutional Amendment level fodder. At best it's a state's rights issue, and a retarded one at that. Marriage is a church issue as far as I'm concerned. The govt just happened to get involved at some point and said, "Oy, you need this slip of paper to make it all official-like."

But then again, this country is becoming such a clusterfuck of reactionary jackasses whose decisions are being less and less guided by reason and more so by their emotions and pastors. I figure in another ten years we'll get back to stoning people to death and Canada will be the shining star of North America.

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Registered: Apr 2003
Location: I cant say I buy this completely,
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It says in very plain language in the book that most Americans consider the word of God himself that faggotry is a sin. How is this not clear to you people? This is why people are against it, not because of emotions or pastors...its a very basic part of their belief system which you may not agree with but at least be honest about the reasons.

It cant be a states right issue because states have to recognise marriages from other states. Have you been paying any attention at all?

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Registered: Jul 2000
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quote:

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Originally posted by 3MTA3
It says in very plain language in the book that most Americans consider the word of God himself that faggotry is a sin. How is this not clear to you people? This is why people are against it, not because of emotions or pastors...its a very basic part of their belief system which you may not agree with but at least be honest about the reasons.

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Registered: Apr 2003
Location: I cant say I buy this completely,
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I cant really defend the whole thing too well cause Im not religious but this is what I hear. It pretty much goes I believe in God so homosexuality is wrong so anything pro-homo is out...at least thats what I hear in a state that voted more than 3 to 1 to consitutionally ban gay marriage.

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Registered: Jul 2000
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Yeah I'm not sticking you personally with it, there's just a pretty glaring jump in the logic train there, if you ask me, the "homosexuality is wrong" to "so anything that doesn't ban it = bad" part specifically. The first part might be dictated by religious faith, the second is dictated by something else.

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quote:

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Originally posted by 3MTA3
It says in very plain language in the book that most Americans consider the word of God himself that faggotry is a sin. How is this not clear to you people? This is why people are against it, not because of emotions or pastors...its a very basic part of their belief system which you may not agree with but at least be honest about the reasons.

It cant be a states right issue because states have to recognise marriages from other states. Have you been paying any attention at all?

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Registered: Aug 2001
Location: Hilbert Space
Posts: 35917

If gay people are allowed to get married, the ability of heterosekshual couples to keep their own marriages going will be lessened and we'll start to see heterosekshual marraiges ending in divorce.

Because, you see, the sanctity of marriage is under threat. It's simple.

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Registered: Oct 2001
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quote:

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Originally posted by Paint CHiPs
But the part I don't get is what makes someone else responsible for my soul? There's nothing in the bible about forcibly disallowing anybody else from sinning, that I can see. For that matter, what part of the bible indicates that we should codify religious beliefs into government....or are they looking in the Koran for that?

...

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Registered: Apr 2003
Location: I cant say I buy this completely,
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Well, I can offer more of what Ive seen from people personally...though I know its not the best evidence or whatever...its just what I see and hear.

Along with the whole religious thing, which isnt really much but a belief in Jesus, I mean people dont bible bang around here...they just self-identify and thats about as deep as it goes...there is also something of a loathing for the faggots. Black people especially just dont like them...but most white folks dont either. They consider it immoral(as I said before) and they look down on the practice in general. You know how people say the world is getting worse all the time? The most common reason for this that I hear, and Ill grant this is from aquaintances at work and in my life that I consider inferior to myself intellectually, is the homo thing. They trace it all to some moral dificiency that in turn results in the breakdown of society, to them all of these things are linked. Of course, no one will openly insult a homo about their sexuality and fag-bashing is at an all time low but when people talk on a personal level about this issue this is what I hear in Georgia and to me it seems representative of general American attitudes though of course it may not be.

Gimpy, if you could read you would have noticed Im not defending the position, just explaining what I see and how I dont see any of this as confusing because I recognize that Americans, while they may watch homos on TV and laugh, dont really like them that much and will vote to deny them marriage rights(theres several votes in several states that prove this). Also, sharia law wont enter into the American judicial system because it is very much incompatible with Western law...you would know this if you knew the basics of sharia, like what a hadud crime is and what sources the law is drawn from...but you dont, you dont know anything.

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Registered: Apr 2005
Location: wookin pa nub
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quote:

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Originally posted by Jazzer
I'll bite...

Fubar, in what way have the democrats told you what to do with your personal life? I might be over generalizing, but it seems like the Republicans (in general) want to limit social freedoms, such as flag burning, war on drugs, gay marriage, etc. Unless you're talking about paying taxes?

Jazz

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Registered: Feb 2004
Location: alaska
Posts: 17509

quote:

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Originally posted by fubar
Eventually, tobacco will be completely illegal, even in your own home. Why should lawmakers be allowed to tell me whether or not I can smoke.

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Registered: Apr 2005
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They shouldn't. I'm all for evolution.

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Registered: Feb 2004
Location: alaska
Posts: 17509

damn you and your lack of hypocrisy

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